Sparky settings and Eastern European machines

[Keith67]

Hi all.

There's a trend I have noticed with MDs and their settings.  It is very rare that I see people running machines at max, and it's common for sensitivity to be around 75% for a "stable search".  Other settings are also commonly set high but well off the max and this seems to be normal.  I have never seen a detectorist, on media or in the flesh say that he's running at 100% sensitivity, and maximum gains, full on everything etc.

With many European machines, say from Russia, Turkey, Bulgaria etc, it often seems the case that they appear to work best way off the high power settings.  I have read articles about the primary design of these machines and the home market for hunting very deep relics from occupied territories during WW1 WW2.  It's often stated that the design parameter means they run far better for UK hunting when they are toned way down to help with differentiating metals and to get more clear identification.

I found it a bit odd when I started the hobby that all the advice was "don't run it at max" or "80% is about right" or "you want to lower that a bit" etc etc. It seems that rarely, if ever, does a machine run well if you try and et 100% out of it.  The best comparison I can make is stereo speakers.  If you throw the volume to 10 the sound can distort, and the speakers start to vibrate and drive you mad.  Turn it to 8 and it's still loud and proud but now it's clear and the music sounds like it's supposed to.

What are your thoughts, and experiences, of machines and settings from around the world, and do all machines have more power than they need to run properly, a bit like the Hi Fi speaker scenario?

[Peter]

My way of attaining best output as far as sensitivities concerned ,is to wind the Sens up till its doing a fireworks impression, then back off the Sensitivity till it becomes nice and stable ,then thats your optimum sensitivity setting for that ground. It works every time for me anyway,so I stick to it.

[oscar6972]

Same here Peter, especially on the Golden Mask machines I have had. Crank it up until it's spitting and spluttering and then just back off until there's just a trace of noise. I found that running it any higher than that led to lots of falsing.

[Keith67]

My way of attaining best output as far as sensitivities concerned ,is to wind the Sens up till its doing a fireworks impression, then back off the Sensitivity till it becomes nice and stable ,then thats your optimum sensitivity setting for that ground. It works every time for me anyway,so I stick to it.

Yeah I think this is what I'm getting at mate, best output from machines is dropping back from max, sensitivity being one of the main factors for many people.  Obviously the amounts vary, as do the machines and their set ups, but I will be surprised if any feedback to this thread talks about running a machine flat out with no issues, especially from East Europe.

[Keith67]

Same here Peter, especially on the Golden Mask machines I have had. Crank it up until it's spitting and spluttering and then just back off until there's just a trace of noise. I found that running it any higher than that led to lots of falsing.

Thanks Chris.  Another example.  It's in no way a criticism on my part, just an observation that many machines if not all have settings that can't really be run at the max, and as stated, deep relic machines seem to need running way off the max, but the irony is this gets the best results.  I think it's something that sounds strange to beginners, certainly it did for me because it's natural to think that the more power you run with the more you will find.  Not the case.

[Rew]

I suppose in a way, these manufacturers are letting you get the most out of the particular machine on the particular ground that your on. All restrictor's have been removed to let you play and get that bit extra.

[Keith67]

I suppose in a way, these manufacturers are letting you get the most out of the particular machine on the particular ground that your on. All restrictor's have been removed to let you play and get that bit extra.

Yes I agree, it makes sense to have a machine set so you have as much power as possible and tune it down slightly, rather than a machine that needs to run on max and leaves you wishing you had more power.  I guess it's part of the learning curve for detectorists, certainly for me I had to come to terms with the fact that reduced settings didn't mean the machine wasn't fully effective, all part of getting the right balance for the right place.

[Sven]

The extra power of European machines amazes those on this side of the pond, especially when they do an air test and are flabbergasted at the extreme
air test depths not generally obtainable with the run of the mill detectors.

Think it was Ziggy that quoted about these incredible air test depths. These are tests with the detector maxed out with all settings that can only be used
detecting in air. Those settings would prove totally unstable or unusable when actually detecting in the ground so you would not see those air test depths in the ground.

The good thing about all the power, your able to use the settings to get the most out of the detector running as much on the ragged edge that you can cope with, like the other poster said, you don't feel you have an underpowered machine, hoping you had more.  That alone would more than likely entice the owner to keep the detector for a longer period of time then wanting to upgrade to a better machine?  If you can't drive the sports car to max, you probably can't drive next step up race car to its fullest potential?

I don't like running very sparky, annoying after awhile. I don't like quiet either, have to wonder if the detector is even on....

[Gary]

We see a lot of air tests centered around these machines, they are just showroom tests designed to attract the un suspecting novices and treasure hunters who are obsessed with depth. Most Bulgarian machines are far to maxxed out for Roman or Medieval sites, even at zero sensitivity.
I think its because the pre-amp and audio response is far to high. Sven could probably answer this better as he has a greater knowledge about the inner workings.

For example if you took a Deus and turned the TX gain up to 3, Audio resonse up to 7, and maxxed out the sensitivity, then you would have a good idea of what some bulgarian machines are about.
As we see in many video's these are perfect settings for video tests when you have a buried target and general chest beating..
These are quite possibly the perfect settings for Bulgarian mountains and desolate area's but not here.
As a result you really get an ear bashing when using one, Deeptech are the only one who listened to our requests.
This is why a few years ago we designed the Deeptech Vista Sprite, it was much calmer with a fully usable power band for UK conditions (Tesoro Silver Sabre style).

[Keith67]

We see a lot of air tests centered around these machines, they are just showroom tests designed to attract the un suspecting novices and treasure hunters who are obsessed with depth. Most Bulgarian machines are far to maxxed out for Roman or Medieval sites, even at zero sensitivity.
I think its because the pre-amp and audio response is far to high. Sven could probably answer this better as he has a greater knowledge about the inner workings.

For example if you took a Deus and turned the TX gain up to 3, Audio resonse up to 7, and maxxed out the sensitivity, then you would have a good idea of what some bulgarian machines are about.
As we see in many video's these are perfect settings for video tests when you have a buried target and general chest beating..
These are quite possibly the perfect settings for Bulgarian mountains and desolate area's but not here.
As a result you really get an ear bashing when using one, Deeptech are the only one who listened to our requests.
This is why a few years ago we designed the Deeptech Vista Sprite, it was much calmer with a fully usable power band for UK conditions (Tesoro Silver Sabre style).

Very interesting Gary, I like the analogy of desolate mountain areas and it should be something people take into account when buying machines, what is there main target customer and what are they primarily designed to do, compared to what a UK detectorist is going to do.

[Lodge Scent]

I think some of it might have to also do with marketing. Everyone wants that machine that can be cranked up for more power..... even if it is irrelevant. Sort of like Spinal Tap with their amplifiers with the knobs that can go up to "11" rather than "10"

[Keith67]

I think some of it might have to also do with marketing. Everyone wants that machine that can be cranked up for more power..... even if it is irrelevant. Sort of like Spinal Tap with their amplifiers with the knobs that can go up to "11" rather than "10"

Classic scene, classic movie.  Certainly think it has a lot to do with marketing.  Just like golf club manufacturers have become obsessed with saying their latest clubs hit the ball further. So what.  If the shot is 150 you pick whatever club you hit that goes 150 yards.  The power becomes irrelevant.

[muddyboots]

You are right, it is about marketing a product to get better sales. Therefore you need something which is going to catch the buyers eye. Every manufacturer does it. There is a lot of competition for sales.
We just need a machine which is easy to use and effective, some of the extra bells and whistles are just to entice the customers and stand out from the other machines on the market.

[Keith67]

You are right, it is about marketing a product to get better sales. Therefore you need something which is going to catch the buyers eye. Every manufacturer does it. There is a lot of competition for sales.
We just need a machine which is easy to use and effective, some of the extra bells and whistles are just to entice the customers and stand out from the other machines on the market.

While I do believe this is true, I do think there's another side to this.  Machines from some countries are aimed at the type of hunting that is popular in their country and those places where they do most trade.  Some companies produce machines that are widely regarded as easy to set up, and simple to run in the UK.  Others need a bit more consideration to settings if they are being used in Britain.  Suffice to say that the air tests you see are a pointless guide as you will never be able to hunt with the machine running so hot once it's pointing at the soil.  Interesting what Gary said about Deeptech producing the Sprite, a machine more tailored for the UK.  An honest machine, simple and effective.  Whereas it appears that for a lot of the machines that hit targets at 24 inches away on air tests, they will never allow you to run at more than about 70% of that power on our hunts/soils and for our targets.

[lifeguard]

To the original question: In my country and area I live, there was a massive WWII fight. Iron shrapnels can be found almost everywhere...and not only shrapnels. The russian army shooted sometimes for hours an area before they attacked it. The power settings of a machine allways depend on the land. There is an old site right next to the willage where you have a lot of iron from every period of history and a LOT of shrapnels. Like an extry busy UK roman site. If you set up a high sensitivity you will get a lot of falsing. But on calm sites where there is just moderate iron contamination you can set the sens up to 97 -98 and the machine remains calm.
And these settings are valid for every machine not only the eastern ones. I had a Golden Mask 4 for 2 years and a nexus standard mk ii for a little time.