Author Topic: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks  (Read 3921 times)

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Keith67

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So the DCMS has announced that all detecting on private land is suspended during lockdown.  The decision was taken after advice from the British Museum.  Obviously this is aimed at stopping groups,  and I understand that, but why was it necessary?

Could it be that the continued efforts of some to hold open digs during the pandemic has shot us all in the foot?  I believe so.

It's the large groups that really bother the archaeologists, and they are firmly on their radar at the moment.  They see large gatherings as high risk of finding and disturbing sites of interest, and rightly or wrongly they want them stopped. People who have staged group digs during the pandemic have caused concerns for different reasons, and regardless of their management of the digs, I don't think it's painted the hobby in a good light.

Clearly the DCMS has the authority to make decisions on our hobby, and they listen to the archaeologists first and foremost.  I realise a lot of people love the open digs and rallies, but there's so many now, and perhaps they could be a bit of a poison chalice?
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lobo

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2020, 11:09 am »
The rules state you can meet up with one other person as long as social distancing is observed. That should be enough to stop the pay and go mob. It's another nail in our hobby instigated by the PAS. Going off the letter of the law, if you are a homeowner you cannot detect in your own garden because it's private land. I personally have emailed my MP to complain that it's biased. For instance fishermen can still go on private land to fish.

Keith67

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2020, 07:49 pm »
Very good points mate
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Gary

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2020, 06:42 pm »
Frustrating I know, but on a plus point it will give the old knees time to recover.

Keith67

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2020, 08:51 pm »
Frustrating I know, but on a plus point it will give the old knees time to recover.


My fear is that we may all get permanent rest for our knees Gary.
The DCMS and British Museum make all the decisions, and there's no-one at their level who can defend the honest hobbyist.
It's ironic when you consider what Detectorists have discovered, but I am starting to fear for the future of the hobby.
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Gary

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2020, 05:09 pm »
You could be right, it makes me think what's happening to the NCMD and FID who we are paying money to.
Are they representing the detectorist these days ?

OldHarry

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2020, 07:25 pm »
Our hobby survives not because of the NCMD, but in spite of it!  To my mind, the NCMD is a cosy talking shop, lacking guts, and is afraid to take on the beasts who oppose us. As a national representative body it's as effective as a concrete parachute. We need a re-vamp.
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Keith67

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2020, 12:35 am »
Our hobby survives not because of the NCMD, but in spite of it!  To my mind, the NCMD is a cosy talking shop, lacking guts, and is afraid to take on the beasts who oppose us. As a national representative body it's as effective as a concrete parachute. We need a re-vamp.


I think they mean well enough, but they go about it in the wrong way in my opinion.  They seem to walk away from the table if they don't like documents or new legislation, as if their opposition will strike a chord.  I think it just puts them further out in the cold. They don't have any real authority, so things just go ahead without them.

I think the hobby has to change.  The NCMD is pretty much a self appointed group, and I don't always agree with their approach. We need to be more open minded to change or we'll be rubbed out.  We need to work closer with archaeology if we want to retain the freedom to detect in general.  We need do need a re-vamp, and the hobby needs to make a clear cut away from people who do not represent the hobby in the right way. 
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OldHarry

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2020, 10:04 am »
I agree with all you said up until the last sentence.

Archaeology is recognized as such, and metal detecting is recognized as a legitimate pastime by the Sport + Recreation Alliance. We certainly don't need to work closer with archaeology to survive; if anything, they need to work closer with us. We need a more effective, pro-active national body. This might mean replacing those at the top with say, a small full-time staff like other national bodies. FID's a different kettle of fish being organised for those who have no access to local detecting clubs but who want insurance cover.

The NCMD has been in existence for 38yrs and in my opinion that's too long to be an amateur body. 

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nailman

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2020, 06:04 pm »
hypothetical question   So No detecting on private land
What happens if someone phones to say they’ve lost a wedding ring in their garden
It’s private land so in theory No!
The wife said the authorities might turn a blind eye, I doubt it somehow
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Gary

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2020, 06:08 pm »
Here's my take on it all, just my personal thoughts.
Has anyone ever made a claim through them ?
Do any of them detect ?
How is our money spent ?
If we are insured I am guessing we should have a policy with our names on it etc.
All this should be transparent to the members, it's easy to say oh it's only £8 but times that by thousands it's a nice package.

Recently all the members got a heavily worded letter saying don't support another group that is threatening to take over, which really pissed a lot of people off.
How much did that mail shot cost US members.
All written on top quality paper.

kred

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2020, 11:31 pm »
I don't know what people expect the NCMD to do. As a group we are viewed as a pariah by the organisations that regulate our hobby i.e. Archeologists, museums and the DCMS. We have little or no power to argue our position and that includes the NCMD. After all what can we and the NCMD do if legislation is brought in to our disadvantage such as the latest recommendations to changes in the antiquities act.
I believe the NCMD rightly took a hard stance against a man who tried to strike a deal with Archeologists to add a new level of licensing to detectorists which included a mandatory training certificate. This traitor to our hobby saw it as a way of profiting off our backs to set himself up as the sole dictator of our hobby. He even set up a training company so he could be the only provider of the "approved" training certificate. This wasn't just a rival group being set up and the NCMD correctly warned us of this idiots intentions.
So what do you really believe the NCMD can do about the latest lockdown restrictions because like it or not they have little power to do anything.......but we do. Every single detectorist should contact their own MP to lobby the government. Every detectorist should use social media to get our point across. The only way we will prevent this type of ludicrous legislation in the future is to get off our butts and fight for our hobby instead of expecting someone else to do it for us.

bigbri

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2020, 10:48 am »
An interesting point that I believe Gary made tho.  Has anyone ever successfully claimed anything?
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Keith67

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2020, 09:03 pm »
I don't know what people expect the NCMD to do. As a group we are viewed as a pariah by the organisations that regulate our hobby i.e. Archeologists, museums and the DCMS. We have little or no power to argue our position and that includes the NCMD. After all what can we and the NCMD do if legislation is brought in to our disadvantage such as the latest recommendations to changes in the antiquities act.
I believe the NCMD rightly took a hard stance against a man who tried to strike a deal with Archeologists to add a new level of licensing to detectorists which included a mandatory training certificate. This traitor to our hobby saw it as a way of profiting off our backs to set himself up as the sole dictator of our hobby. He even set up a training company so he could be the only provider of the "approved" training certificate. This wasn't just a rival group being set up and the NCMD correctly warned us of this idiots intentions.
So what do you really believe the NCMD can do about the latest lockdown restrictions because like it or not they have little power to do anything.......but we do. Every single detectorist should contact their own MP to lobby the government. Every detectorist should use social media to get our point across. The only way we will prevent this type of ludicrous legislation in the future is to get off our butts and fight for our hobby instead of expecting someone else to do it for us.



"I don't know what people expect the NCMD to do."

Well if you are going to call yourself a "National Council" then you have to protect your members, and they haven't.  You can't just reject the viewpoints of the authoritarians and defend your hobby while it's riddled with rule breakers and people who bring us into disrepute.

What they needed to do was get involved with the authorities, and accept that we'll need to change a bit if we want to be respected.  I have no problem with licensing and certification if it distances me from the idiots that feed the negative opinions of detecting in general.  We keep saying that we're a hobby with a majority of good honest people but talk gets you no-where if your aligned with the people who drag us down.

The only reason that we have a new group suggesting licences and certificates (gaining much support from the authorities) is because the NCMD didn't do it years ago, giving us the integrity we need,  gaining inclusion in future decision making, and making a clear disassociation from the bad element who could get us all banned.
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nailman

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Re: Blanket ban on detecting private land in the UK for next 4 weeks
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2020, 10:07 pm »
You raise some valid points,
“it's riddled with rule breakers and people who bring us into disrepute.”
even if the IOD money making scheme  takes off ,You will still get the bad elements even with licensing
I am not impressed with the ruling no detecting on Private land but ok on public beaches.

I’am not impressed with the lack of response by the NCMD and if the NCMD wasn’t part of my club membership, I would consider the FID .
But there is no way I will be paying £60-£100 for a days so called training and then no doubt a membership and reregistration fee

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